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Bill Brink's Pirates Winter Meetings chat: 12.13.17
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Bill Brink
3:28
You can assume. Contending without Cole or McCutchen will be tough with as much as they need to go right this year. But it will likely be more of a one- or two-year thing rather than a White Sox teardown.
Rosy Scenario
3:28
Seems like WAY too many things need to happen for this roster as presently constructed to have a winning season?
Bill Brink
3:29
That's a fair assessment. A lot of things need to happen. Internal improvement will go a long way, but it's needed in several different positions.
Tim
3:30
For next season, where do you think the Bucs rank in the division? 3rd? Or lower?
Bill Brink
3:30
Third is a good starting point. The Cardinals just got Osuna and relief help and might not be done, and the Cubs have made moves too. Milwaukee is a wild card. The Reds still have too many holes in their pitching staff, despite a strong lineup. But the Pirates could finish higher than third if their core stays healthy and produces.
Go Bucs
3:31
Tell me if I'm on the right track here...Pirates are an LLC, Nutting is majority owner, but thus has other minority owners to consider. If he puts his own money in--which no owner of any business does anyway--his ownership share goes up, which may not even be allowed because of ownership agreements. If it is allowed, minority owners may have to put in more so their ownership stake doesn't change. So, this is all to say that fans don't understand he can't just give a blank check to a FA and say "fill it out, I got you covered."
To continue on my question, I can't find anywhere the names of any minority owners/board members, Nutting's controlling stake, or the Pirates as an LLC or other type of corporation, so I would love some insight as to whether on the right track--which I believe I am.
Bill Brink
3:34
You're on the right track. They're listed in the media guide and there are 15 of them. And if I remember from the leaked 2008-09 financial documents, they are an LLC, though I can't find those PDFs at present. I'll keep looking.
Tim
3:35
Does it make more sense for the Pirates to start re-building? Aren't they closer to the bottom of the NL Central then the top?
Bill Brink
3:36
You can argue both ways, which I'm sure the Pirates have, internally. Keep McCutchen, Cole and Harrison, the young starters improve, Cole keeps the ball in the park, Polanco and Marte stay healthy and produce (Cervelli too), Kontos and Hudson set up well, 90 wins is not impossible. If Polanco and Cervelli miss time, if Marte doesn't hit, if McCutchen starts slow again, if Cole's inconsistencies continue, if injuries hit the rotation harder than last year, they won't contend and a rebuild could make sense.
AK
3:37
Also I understand Nutting not wanting to go through tearing down the whole team and rebuilding but selling Cole, McCutchen is not a complete teardown. It would be a quick rebuild. What good does he gain by continuing to hope for some luck and remain mediocre?
Bill Brink
3:37
The first part of this answer applies to the next two questions ...
Tim
3:37
If they bring everyone back, isn't the ceiling for this team still only about 80-85 wins?
Does your gut say that the Bucs keep everyone and try to contend again this year, or tear it down?
Bill Brink
3:37
I doubt they tear it down. I think they could trade one of Cole, McCutchen or Harrison.
bill
3:38
how can they reasonably not expect attendance to plunge if cutch and/or cole are traded?
Bill Brink
3:38
They probably can't, especially after losing more than 4,000 fans per game from 2016 to '17.
Tim
3:38
Have you heard of any FA 3rd options for the Bucs? Waiting on Kang, and overplaying Freese aren't great options, even with some bench guys
Bill Brink
3:41
Nunez would make sense. Flaherty, Kendrick, Escobar.
Sluggo
3:41
Do you believe that Nutting has any interest at all about winning. The integrity of the whole organization to me is in question unless the bottom line is the bottom line
Bill Brink
3:42
I believe Nutting wants to win but I don't believe he will allow that to outweigh his interest in doing what he thinks is best for the long-term future of the franchise.
Tim
3:42
I know it's not realistic in Pitt (which is sad), but what type of contract do you think Andrew could ask for after this year? 0% chance the Pirates would offer something close enough? It would be an encouraging sign to long-suffering fans...
Bill Brink
3:43
Depends on his platform year this year, but: Ellsbury got seven and $153, Pence got five and $90, Jones got six and $85, so I think you start there.
AK
3:43
But... if they trade ONE of Cole, McCutchen or Harrison... what's the point? McCutchen was going to leave anyway. If Cole is traded, our rotation looks much less reliable. Harrison is the only one I can see traded and the Pirates keep trying to contend.
Bill Brink
3:43
That's asking a lot of Rodriguez, Moroff and Frazier to both fill in for Harrison and spell Freese, but yes, that's probably the scenario that gives them the best chance to contend.
We're going to speak with Huntington in 15 minutes. Lightning round. Go.
AK
3:45
In your opinion would NL Central easier in 2 years or harder
Bill Brink
3:45
Harder. Cubs and Cardinals aren't going anywhere, Brewers are getting better and the Reds will be good if they ever get a pitching staff.
BDI600
3:45
The Cubs recently hired Jim Benedict; no word on Marc Delpiano. Do you know if there were any discussions about either returning to Pittsburgh?
Bill Brink
3:45
I believe Huntington said on the radio that the Pirates had reached out to them after Miami let them go.
bill
3:45
how can a bad offensive team justify trading the face  of the franchise?
Bill Brink
3:46
By bringing back premium young talent in return that could produce at a high level at controllable salaries.
Not what fans want to hear, but that's how you can justify it.
Wayward
3:46
To me it makes sense to trade all 3.  This team needs a 3B, another corner OF, and catcher of the future (all with some power potential).  There is very little to none of these types in the system now.  Combine this with the upcoming middle infielders, SP and RP and the future could be positive.  Given how this organization operates, it is really the only model that would work.  Am I wrong?
Bill Brink
3:47
Not necessarily, but I don't think they want to do that and win 71 games for two years, especially after the attendance drop.
Tim
3:47
Does it bother MLB executives that teams like the Pirates can't afford to keep their own home-grown players?
Bill Brink
3:47
Don't know for sure but can't imagine it does because that means those executives get to acquire those guys.
Steven
3:47
If McCutchen is traded at midseason, this past season shows that return is probably light (i.e. Martinez, Bruce), not to mention new team can't offer QO. If he isn't traded, Bucs only come out with end-of-first round or end-of-Comp B pick, depending, which is one player that won't be difference making. Are either of these options more or less what to expect right now? The situation is seriously tricky.
Bill Brink
3:48
Steven, this is as good an analysis of the conundrum the Pirates face as I could come up with. That's exactly the situation. I will end the chat on that note. Thanks everyone!
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